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NEW MEDALS FOR PAST SERVICE: INSULTS REPEATED
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Post NEW MEDALS FOR PAST SERVICE: INSULTS REPEATED 
I AM TRULY ANGRY!

Having closed the matter of the PJM in a very final way; (and one can almost
feel the delight of DS Sec Dept behind it), see The Pingat Jasa Malaysia and
***Pingat Jasa Malaysia - Update March 2007***, they then proceed to
publish the "revised" New medals for past service.

I reproduce both versions and with the exception of the omission of naming
the PJM, I don't believe they have been touched. This was NEVER revised; you will
note that it even includes the typing errors in the original. The first copy is the
"REVISED" version, the original is below.

The references to the"veterans now retired from full eployment"
"seeing individuals proudly displaying....."
"This has encouraged them to seek new campaign medals for past service."
"The MOD receives on these pArticular subjects and many
other similar campaigns from disaffected veterans (note even the typing error
is the same pA).
In addition in recent months...The MOD has refused to allow
veterans to receive a campaign medal (PJM is not named)
offered by the Malaysian Government for service between 1957 and 1967

It also carries on to stigmatise the veterans and the media etc...."

THIS IS ABSOLUTELY DISGRACEFUL. I believe that we need to contact a senior member of the Government
or Opposition, or the current Defence Minister to bring this to the attention of Sir Gus O'Donnell. I feel
that a DS Sec officer or officers have failed to observe most, if not all, of the conventions laid down in the
Civil Service Code book. This is irony at its worst. (I use irony instead of the cruder word)







Last edited by GLOman on Sun Mar 18, 2007 8:55 am; edited 3 times in total
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David

Thanks for highlighting those glaring errors, I think you will find that many matters are being attended to, it is just that we need a bit more time. BTW it is Sir Gus O'Donnell Head of the CS, I wrote to him last July time, no reply



Last edited by John Cooper on Sun Mar 18, 2007 8:59 am; edited 3 times in total

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Post New medals for past service 
Thanks for that John, I haven't really cheated - just
a bit of editing! Sir Gus O'Donnell. The trouble with
writing to the Department it gets picked up by the
"Goalkeepers",and what happens then is anybody's guess!

Regards

David

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Just when you thought you were no longer disaffected, you are again! Yep the MoD Veterans Agency have done it again, I have just fired this off to these eejits

Date: Sat, 17 Mar 2007 22:07:30 +0000 (GMT)
From: "JOHN COOPER"
Subject: Re: Disaffected Veteran
To: twiggd@parliament.uk, Bill.Jeffrey480@mod.uk, defencesecretary@mod.uk, Watsont@parliament.uk, Richard.Coney506@mod.uk, Ian.Keith798@mod.uk, ingrama@parliament.uk

Sirs
I am again drawing to your attention to what can only be described as 'a war on words' where again your Veterans Agency has published a damning report about its own veterans (me included) by calling some of us 'disaffected'.

I take extreme exception to this report again after an assurance by Ms. Ann Moyes on behalf of The Rt. Hon. Derek Twigg MP that the offending article would be removed, are you trying to deliberately confront a group of ex Servicemen and women and provoke them into some sort of adverse reaction, as it certainly appears you have achieved your goal.

I am disgusted even more than I was previously, can't you people get anything right?

Yours sincerely

John Cooper

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
JOHN COOPER wrote:

Derek Twigg MP Veterans Minister MoD

Dear Mr Twigg

According to the Veterans Agency website, I am a 'disaffected veteran' simply because I question an ill judged decision by The Grant of Honours and Decorations Committee on the awarding of a medal by The King of Malaysia namely The Pingat Jasa Malaysia.

I take extreme exception to this statement on an official Government website, I wish to receive an apology from your department over this matter and would ask that the perpetrator of this statement is brought to book immediately.

Thank you for your attention

John Cooper


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Post Re; Veterans Agency Article 
Sent to the following list of addressees:

peter.ricketts@fco.gov.uk, Bill.Jeffrey480@mod.uk, denis.brennan@cabinet-office.x.gsi.gov.uk, tanya.collingridge@fco.gov.uk, defencesecretary@mod.uk, Watsont@parliament.uk, Richard.Coney506@mod.uk, Ian.Keith798@mod.uk, ingrama@parliament.uk,twiggd@parliament.uk.

CC: touhigd@parliament.uk


Having very recently read the 'modified' text on the Veterans Agency WebPages, let me state that I am shocked and saddened beyond belief to witness such callous insult emanating from an agency that purports to be working to the benefit of veterans.

The text in question was originally 'pulled', supposedly for the purpose of revision as it was 'out of date'...an apparent euphemism for 'under mass public criticism'?....The replaced text so closely resembles the original that it even includes an inadvertent 'typo' contained within the original text...and it certainly still contains all of the scurrilous innuendo which originally made it the object of so much criticism .

Not only is this notice irresponsible and ill-informed...it is, worst of all, inaccurate.

Any official who lends his/her name to such an unwarranted and malicious attack upon a definable group of veterans should be heartily ashamed of him/her self....Such tactics are completely reprehensible....certainly not the actions one might expect of professional persons.

Sincerely,

'Jock' Fenton.
Address supplied


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Post New medals for...Insults repeated 
I hope that they don't think that we are naive enough to accept
an explanation that - "it was a clerical error by some junior clerk".

It was removed after consultation between Ms Ann Moyes Veterans
Agency and Mr Ian Keith DS Sec Honours and Ceremonial. I believe
that it would have needed the authority of a ranking, i.e. senior civil
servant to have had this "revised" version re-posted on their (VA) site.
It was obviously accepted by VA without any checking of content
to ensure that it was not offensive which makes them, too,
responsible for the anguish its reappearance has caused!

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I READ IN THE TEXT THAT THE M.O.D. IS UNABLE TO PUT IT'S SIDE,MY I SUGGEST THEY LOOK AT THE REASON'S FOR DISAFFECTION AMONGST VETERANS,NOW FIRST UP REMEMBER VETERANS LAPEL BADGE IS A SURVIVORS AWARD ,SO LETS LOOK AT THE TRACK RECORD OF THE M.O.D. 50 YRS TO GET COMPENSATION FOR THE RELATIVES OF A YOUNG SERVICEMAN POISENED,TO DEATH @ PORTON DOWN .WITH A NERVE AGENT,WE ALL NOW KNOW GULF WAR SYNDROME ACCORDING TO THE M.O.D. IS A MYTH,AS ARE THE VETS AND THEIR ILLNESSES FROM THE NUCLEAR TEST,WEARING THEIR ALL OVER PROTECTION GEAR ,ie,SUNGLASSES,THE WITHOLDING OF EVIDENCE FROM CORONERS INQUESTS INTO @FRIENDLY FIRE DEATHS,MOUNTING CASUALTIES AWAITING TREATMENT,THE CURE; SHUT OUR LAST MILITARY HOSPITAL @ AT HASLAR GOSPORT,NOW SENT TO SELLY OAK TO BE ABUSED BY RACIST FOREIGNERS,AND REQUIRED TO GET OUT OF UNIFORM AS IT MIGHT UPSET OTHER PATIENTS,WELL AS WE KNOW THERE ARE LIES ,DECIECT,MAL ADMINISTRATION,HYPROCRITES,YEP AND THEN THE M.O.D. SO WOULDN@T IT BE NICE FOR THEM TO REPLY USING THESE PAGES,YEP I'M SURE YOUR WELCOME TO GIVE US YOUR SIDE,BUT WITH THE TRACK RECORD ,OF THE DISGARCEFUL TREATMENT OF OUR VETS ,I WOULD HAVE THOUGHT THAT SILENCE WOULD ACTUALLY BE A PREFERRED OPTION. NATUALLY THE REASON FOR DISAFFECTION IS NOT UNDERSTOOD,BUT GIVEN THE NUMBERS DIS AFFECTED,MAY I BE SO BOLD , THAT AS FORMER PATRIOTIC SERVANTS OF THE CROWN,WHO FAR OUTNUMBER (400,000 VETS BADGES ISSUED TO DATE) STAFF AT THE M.O.D.,AND HAVE LEAD A FAR FULLER LIVES ALL OVER THE WORLD,AND SAVE THEIR DIS AFFECTION FOR M.O.D. THE NUMBERS INVOLVED,CONVINCE ME AT LEAST ,THAT THE PROBLEM ISN'T THE VETS,BUT THE PRATS WHO ADMINSTER, WE ARE BUT A SYMPTON,M.O.D. IS THE DISEASE,GET A LIFE ,DO YOUR DUTY BY THE VETS,NOT BY WHAT YOU DEEM YOUR STANDARD,YOU ARE NOW FREE TO REPLY.

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Post Veterans Agency 
Copy of my email to the VA.

Sirs,
Once again an insulting and inaccurate statement has been posted on your web site concerning the Pingat Jasa Malaysia Medal (PJM) I respectfully request that you remove it or at least allow us to respond by placing our own comments along side these outrageous statements.

I must also point out that evidence has come to light that British Veterans has Her Majesties permission to wear the PJM.
See London Gazette 3rd May 1968.
My MP has Government papers that prove this. With this in mind I also ask you to print that British Veterans may wear their PJM on all occasions.

UNDER THE FREEDOM of INFORMATION ACT.
I request the name of the department and or departments that posted these inaccurate statements about the PJM.
I also require the name of the individual who is responsible for writing these statements.

I thank you for your time and look forward to your reply ASAP. (You may reply by email if you wish)

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Do you have a page no or other indexing for the L Gazette ref? Then one can look it up online. Thanks in advance!

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[quote="LochFada"]Do you have a page no or other indexing for the L Gazette ref? Then one can look it up online. Thanks in advance![/quote]
LOCH FADA,NOW THERES A NAME FROM THE PAST!

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LochFada wrote:
Do you have a page no or other indexing for the L Gazette ref? Then one can look it up online. Thanks in advance!


http://www.gazettes-online.co.uk/archiveViewFrameSetup.asp?webType=0&PageDuplicate=x0%20%20%20%20%20%20&issueNumber=44579&pageNumber=0&SearchFor=crown&selMedalType=&selHonourType=

Regards,

Barry


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Post Loch Fada to ro5 from MB 
..



Last edited by MB on Thu Feb 14, 2008 12:45 pm; edited 1 time in total

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Post BEING IN THE SERVICE OF THE CROWN 
BarryF wrote:


http://www.gazettes-online.co.uk/archiveViewFrameSetup.asp?webType=0&PageDuplicate=x0%20%20%20%20%20%20&issueNumber=44579&pageNumber=0&SearchFor=crown&selMedalType=&selHonourType=

Regards,

Barry


Barry, this may be a little more complicated than it looks.

For instance does BEING IN THE SERVICE OF THE CROWN include all those UK citizens (ex-service or civilian) who are on the payroll of HMG? These would include, Police, Prison staff, Civil servants, nurses, doctors and numerous others who are paid by HMG and the taxpayer.

Therefore only UK citizens (ex-service civilians) who are employed in the private sector, or are old age pensioners at age 65 can honestly say they are no longer BEING IN THE SERVICE OF THE CROWN

Any chance of looking into this?

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If you are not in the service of the Crown when the PJM were awarded to the British in 2005 you can wear the PJM.
Prison Officers work for the Home office i.e. The Crown.
Police are governed by the Home Office but work for the Local Council just like the Firemen.
See your council tax bill.

I'm not going to do the suits work for them, but I have looked for an amendment to the LG Statement I cannot find one, so it stands.
Private Citizens can WEAR the PJM.
let the suits prove otherwise I say they Can't.

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Post MoD explanation and apology 
The following was received today by all members of the Fight4 team:

Gentlemen,

Thank you for your various e-mails this morning complaining about the reappearance of the “Medals for Past Service” article which I arranged to have removed from the Veterans Agency (VA) Internet website site some weeks ago.

I was as surprised as you to see that it had reappeared. As far as we were concerned, it had been removed permanently and completely. It had been on the site for many years, long before the PJM had become an issue. As soon as Malaya/Borneo veterans expressed their concern about its content it was deleted by the VA on the direct instructions from us, as it was never intended to cause offence.

We contacted the VA’s Webmaster first thing this morning, on receipt of your e-mails. He investigated and advised us that due to a technical “glitch” of some sort, the article had been uploaded to the new PJM Update page. This was not intentional and the page was removed as soon as the error was reported. The complete Medals section was taken off-line for the material to be deleted and then reloaded afresh.

On behalf of the VA, the Department unreservedly apologises for any offence unintentionally caused by this technical error.

Richard Coney
DS Sec - Honours 1
8/J Main Building
Whitehall
London SW1A 2HB


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