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Is it too late for this country?
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Post Is it too late for this country? 
I have initiated a separate Forum in order to publicise the existence of a paper written by the Rt Hon Michael Ancram QC MP in May 2006. Michael Ancram served in the last Conservative Government and during the last four years has held the portfolios of Shadow Foreign Secretary and Shadow Defence Secretary. He currently serves on the House of Commons Intelligence Select Committee.

This paper presents a depressing picture and offers some stark choices. As Michael Ancram says "It is an historic truth that the first responsibility of Government is the defence of its citizens and their interests”. In my view the present MoD incumbents starting from Des Browne downwards, simply do not understand the problem and are not displaying any readiness or willingness to recognise that there is a need for an urgent review.

Most PJMers are ex-Armed Forces and will better understand the problem. They are aware of the degradation in the British defence systems - a degradation so severe that it has resulted in:

• The Royal Navy is being increasingly beached - woe betide us if we have another Falklands to deal with.
• The RAF is becoming smaller and smaller - in only nine years this government has reduced the number of squadrons by 25%, and we are down to only 32.
• The Army is in melt down - as numbers diminish, those that are left are on front line duty and so training has had to be reduced by 20%.
• The Reservists are disappearing - down by 25% in three years and from a strength of 56,200 to 36,200 since 1998.
• Equipment is in a shambles - each day we are reminded about poor and scarce equipment leading to more and more loss of life and injuries; at any one time 25% of the helicopter fleet is grounded because of mechanical problems; more than 50% of our armoured vehicle fleet is not fit for service.

The paper can be read and/or downloaded here - http://www.fight4thepjm.org/documents/michael_ancram_british_defence_in_crisis.pdf

Please read this document and write to your MP about it. Send him or her the document itself, or this link to the Global Strategy Forum at http://www.globalstrategyforum.org/articleshow.asp?ref=14

Thank you,

Barry

PS We are receiving letters from the MoD about the PJM - from Des Browne the Defence Secretary and his various Ministers and Civil Servants - that portray a Department in crisis. In my view they are the most arrogant and disinterested of all Departments (few of these people have been in the Armed Forces and those that have do not seem to understand the problem - they just want to toe a party line) and, most dangerous of all, they are ill-informed and unwilling to even contemplate that they need to review anything. I hope they read and digest Michael Ancram’s paper before it is too late.

On a more local note, what chance is there of the PJM being treated openly and honestly in the context of the MoD's ingrained policy of never being willing to consider other opinions - they are too busy demolishing our defences and our regiments (now 4 fewer than when we started this web site!


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BarryF, who fought for the Right to Wear the Pingat Jasa Malaysia
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Post Re: Is it too late for this country? 
BarryF wrote:
On a more local note, what chance is there of the PJM being treated openly and honestly in the context of the MoD's ingrained policy of never being willing to consider other opinions - they are too busy demolishing our defences and our regiments (now 4 fewer than when we started this web site!


The MOD needs to get to work on this right away. They won't of course because they're too busy polishing their own brand of bullsh*t.

Morale is a major problem. These civvies simply do not understand what motivates people to join the Armed Forces and to make a career out of it. And they've made sure that the most senior ranks in the Forces are those that will back them up.

Potential recruits see not only what is happening to serving men and women but also how the MOD treats veterans. Look at the PJM medal. The MOD is kicking us in the teeth! It's a bloody scandal. Kicking us in the teeth achieves nothing except an awareness that you'll not get any thanks from this government if you place your life on the line to bail them out of illegal wars.

I'm sick and tired of these people in the MOD and their arrogance and total disregard for matters which do not affect their pensions. Mr Ancram puts the questions into the arena, but I think he'll get the same response that we do. A blank wall of total misunderstanding! Only problem is, this time it's not just 35,000 veterans getting stuffed, it's our country that will suffer as a result. Just watch what will happen soon in the Falklands when they get wind of the facts in Mr Ancram's paper.

Keep up the good fight against those wasters. Ron.

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Post Re: Is it too late for this country? 
BarryF wrote:
Please read this document and write to your MP about it. Send him or her the document itself, or this link to the Global Strategy Forum at http://www.globalstrategyforum.org/articleshow.asp?ref=14


This paper tells a story of a disaster waiting to happen. I shall write to my MP. No wonder we can't get anywhere with the MOD. I'll remind my MP about our fight too. Thanks for pointing this paper out to everyone. Have you sent the link top Des Browne?

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Post Re: Is it too late for this country? 
BarryF wrote:
Please read this document and write to your MP about it.


Good grief!

I'm going to write to my MP and Mr Des Browne and to every member of the MOD that I can trace. I see there are a number of usef addresses on your Lobby page that others might find helpful.

Regards, Tom.

PS I take my hat off to those fighting for the right to wear the PJM on behalf of people like me. It must be depressing at times but we hope you will Keep At 'Em as you say on your web site.

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Post A Black Day Indeed 
Barry, little did I think when I sent you the paper that it would explode in such fashion, well done. You can see now that Michael is well onside in the Defence battle and has received a lot of praise for his forthright views which as he explains, he has really only been able to expound on returning to the back benches. We are indeed in the throes of the worst crisis of modern times in relation to defence and I pray that Mr. Cameron when having his next shower will rediscover those two small round things that hang between his legs and wake up to reality.

Regards to you all
John

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Post Re: A Black Day Indeed 
jireland wrote:
Barry, little did I think when I sent you the paper that it would explode in such fashion, well done. You can see now that Michael is well onside in the Defence battle


John, I didn't either and I'm pleased you sent the paper to me. I have just re-read it and remain stunned. The Government, and teh MoD in particular, and Des Browne about whom I am not so particular. He will not approach anything with an open mind - a very dangerous state of affairs in State Affairs and indefensible in Defence matters. I shall write to Richard Benyon and ask him to support Michael Ancram but I suspect he is already doing that.

I do not consider this Forum Topic to be either a digression or a political issue. Our localised matter (the PJM fight) reflects the very same problems of the macro problem (the Brotish Defence Crisis) in so far as this Government has stopped listening not only to the ordinary man and woman in the street, but also to those whose views they should be seeking. Roll on the next election. I, for one, will never forget what has happened to Britain's Defence system since 1997. And I for one will never forget the contempt with which I and my PJM have been treated.

The MoD are spending too much time trying to manufacture excuses to deny a few veterans their right to wear their medal when they should be spending that time (and money) on developing our Defence systems to meet the threat that we have before us today.

They should instead be encourageing our veterans and our forces and our potential recruits, not totally hissing them off with their civil servant's out-dated and discredited policies that the politicians like Des Browne are too eager to a accept in order to enjoy an easy life in positions into which they have been promoted well beyond the competence and comprehension. The PJM should be allowed to be worn with pride and that pride should permeate up through the whole system.

Thanks for bringing it to our attention.

Barry


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Post Re: A Black Day Indeed 
jireland wrote:
We are indeed in the throes of the worst crisis of modern times in relation to defence and I pray that Mr. Cameron when having his next shower will rediscover those two small round things that hang between his legs and wake up to reality.


I'm from Scotland. My MP supports the PJM (Mr Mundell). I'll write to him about Michael Ancram's paper. I will also ask him to ask the Defence Minister what the hell he is up to.

I was in the KOSBs, a Regiment that had over 300 years of tradition behind it before it was destroyed, and I am entitled to the PJM. I'm disgusted with the way we were treated in London by a Government that has so many Scottish members. Isn't Des Browne Scottish? And the next Prime Minister, the Rt Hon Gordon Brown? And the MOD Minister for the Armed Forces, Adam Ingram? And with a name like Tom Watson, I wonder if the MOD Veterans Minister has any Scottish connections!

People up here in Edinburgh will not join up to the new faceless Battalions despite the £1,200 I understand people have been offered to get their mates to join up to fill the recruiting widening gap! The Government (none of them have ever worn a uniform) just don't understand what it is all about. I don't think they care. They think they won't be in power when the crap hits the fan again in a big way.

The Ancram paper is more imoprtant than that, though. Unless we start rebuilding our defences now, you can take it from me that one day soon we shall reap the harvest that this crappy Government is sowing for us.

Good luck to England later today - and the palyers should remember that they are in battle with this country's oldest military ally!

Cheers, Ian Stewart.

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Post British Defence in Crisis 
Phew!!! I had a pretty good idea that we were deep in the doodah, but this report really shows that we are deeper in than I thought. I can now see why Michael Ancram chose to leave the front bench - his report is dynamite, or would be if we could afford to buy any. I have posted the link on the Royalwings site where a group of ex RAF types cogitate over the woes of the nation, the Universe and the price of fags. I shall also circulate it around the people I work with. Will the last person to leave the country please put out the cat, turn off the lights and make sure that the Civil (?) Servants are locked securely in the capsule before blasting them back to their home planet, Zodd, where everyone is issued with 3 green antennae but are not allowed to wear them (formally of course).


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Post Re: A Black Day Indeed 
Ian Stewart wrote:
Government that has so many Scottish members. Isn't Des Browne Scottish? And the next Prime Minister, the Rt Hon Gordon Brown? And the MOD Minister for the Armed Forces, Adam Ingram? And with a name like Tom Watson, I wonder if the MOD Veterans Minister has any Scottish connections!


I could have added Lord Drayson, MOD Minister in the Lords. There was an alleged hint of cash for perrages btu I'm sure that couldn't be true. After all, he's now imposing his personal approach to achievement to his role in the Ministry of Defence. See http://politics.guardian.co.uk/funding/story/0,11893,1290153,00.html and you may spot a few!

Is this a different Lord Drayson? It must be. But I rememebr reading that a Lord Drayson was appointed by Mr Blair as the Defence Procurement Minister. If it is ther same man, then that Guardian piece is revealing "Labour insists that Lord Drayson is a wealthy man - his family shared £100m when Powderject was sold to GlaxoSmithKline -and is at liberty to make such a gift. Two inquiries have cleared ministers and the company of impropriety over the award of a £32m contract to provide the Department of Health with smallpox vaccine, party officials stressed last night. "

I know we don't want to get into politics, but I'd like to know if the alleged quotes above about a munti-millionnaire are to do with a Procurement Minister in a Department (the MOD) that is going down the drain because of ignorance and alleged lack of money (and men and womend are dying as a result because they don't have the right kit), and one that is making PJM men and women pay for the postage on their own medal.

Thank you.

Ian

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Post Re: British Defence in Crisis 
GerryL wrote:
I have posted the link on the Royalwings site where a group of ex RAF types cogitate over the woes of the nation, the Universe and the price of fags. I shall also circulate it around the people I work with.


God help us all.

I pray that Michael Ancram's words are in time.

I also pray that you win this fight for the right to wear the PJM that they started. Whenever I speak to ordinary people they simply do not believe that this government, any government, would be so small-minded and deceitful.

Alistair Taylor

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Post Re: British Defence in Crisis 
GerryL wrote:
.................and make sure that the Civil (?) Servants are locked securely in the capsule before blasting them back to their home planet, Zodd, where everyone is issued with 3 green antennae but are not allowed to wear them (formally of course).


Are you sure you have your facts right there Gerry, I thought they were from ZARB anyway they are not from the same planet I traipse on!

It is great to see new contributors to this forum, welcome aboard we need your support like New Labour needs supporters from the Blaneau Gwent area. Rest assured we know what we are talking about THEY don't, I wonder if anyone has ever asked this bunch of cruds if they have ever worn the sweaty tee shirt, sent the dirty postcard or know what a piece of four by two is, I doubt it, they have their heads firmly stuck up someone elses Jacksy to see where the sun is shining from. They have not got a clue, sad really that these people are purporting to represent the majority and yet hold the reins of power by the minority. God help us all!


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Post A Black Day Getter Blacker 
Let us all pray that the likes of us and our battle to have an honourable medallic award recognised can perhaps lead to even greater things such as being able to defend our nation once more. It has certainly stirred Michael into action, he even joined me in the RBL!

John

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Post Re: British Defence in Crisis 
Ali Taylor wrote:
GerryL wrote:
I have posted the link on the Royalwings site where a group of ex RAF types cogitate over the woes of the nation, the Universe and the price of fags. I shall also circulate it around the people I work with.


I will write to my MP and post that link on forums I write to. I will also tell friends and relatives. Everyone needs to know. It's their future, their children's future. I will also mention the PJM fight - that is a small issue compared the Michael Ancram paper but it is what the problem is all about at grass roots level. Alistair.

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Post Re: A Black Day Getter Blacker 
jireland wrote:
Let us all pray that the likes of us and our battle to have an honourable medallic award recognised can perhaps lead to even greater things such as being able to defend our nation once more.


John, I earnestly believe that the two are linked. It is the mind set of these under-achievers, who are now achieving the destruction of our pride and the nation's security, that is seriously in question. When they issue disinformation and obfuscate the truth just to deny some veterans a little bit of pride, and are willing to divide the Commonwealth and snub a moderate Muslim Commonwealth country in these difficult times, what are they getting up to when it really matters? Certainly not underpinning our security - more like undermining it.

Barry


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Post A Tiger by the Tail 
Barry, I think that what you have just said is the whole matter in a nutshell. Now if they had given us the right to wear in the first place they may never have had a Tiger by the tail!

Best wishes
John

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